Sometimes We Find Our Way By Waiting: Ann Voskamp & Brennley Brown
This episode may be triggering for some listeners.
Ann Voskamp: Something very sacred and intentional and beautiful is happening in the waiting. Our hearts are being woven to the Lord. It’s like a three-legged race where our hearts, our lives have been tied to the Lord so that we are walking with Him. So I think when we wait on the Lord and our lives are being entwined, we’re actually being strengthened in God.
Sometimes We Find Our Way By Waiting: Ann Voskamp & Brennley Brown – Episode #452
Narrator: Welcome to the Jesus Calling Podcast. This week, we have writer and speaker Ann Voskamp back on the podcast. Ann shares insights from her personal experiences with anxiety and brokenness and what she found out while she waited through those uncomfortable moments, and how she used scripture, prayer, and the practice of writing to heal her mind and become closer to God.
Later in the episode, we’ll hear from Christian country music artist Brennley Brown. Raised in the high desert of Southern California, and now playing music in Nashville, Brennley got her start in voiceover work before gaining national recognition as the youngest finalist on The Voice. She shares her own experience with waiting while her mother battled a health crisis, and how that time led her to find out where she should go with her music—and her life.
Let’s begin with our time with Ann.
Ann Voskamp: My name is Ann Voskamp and I live way up north on a farm in Canada. I feed a lot of pet sheep. I take care of a lot of dogs. And in the quiet moments, the margins early and late, I like to sit down with the Lord. And some people would say that I’m a writer, but I often think of myself as a waiter. My vocational calling is to wait on the Lord as He gives words. And as you wait on the Lord, you do what writers are meant to do. Waiters wait on the Lord and serve people. And my calling is to go ahead and serve people with words. So I write books.
I am so grateful that I was able to connect with the community here at the Jesus Calling Podcast back in 2018, which seems like just a blink ago. Sarah Young‘s pastor is a close friend of ours. And he said, “You know, Ann, my wife and I have a surprise for you if we can just hop in our car. We’ve got something up our sleeves that we think would really just bless you.” So he and his wife Patty drove me to this lovely home and we parked up front and I was really confused. He said, “If we go up to the door, I will introduce you to someone who I think will be deeply meaningful for you and her just to connect.” I knocked on a door and this very kind, gentle—she just really exuded the grace and humility of Jesus—introduced herself to me as Sarah Young.
So I had an afternoon with Sarah and just to hear her heart and her heart after the Lord and how her whole life was truly about, What does it mean to live worshiping the Lord in union and communion with Him? And Sarah and I, our hearts really did connect over worship, over gratitude, and what my journey has been about—living a life of worship to the Lord—connected with Sarah’s heart, which was really about, How do we live a life that is listening to Jesus and hearing Him speak to us through His Word and living in intimate communion with Him?
So much has happened for all of us since 2018. The world has been changed and upended and turned around in so many ways. Going through a pandemic and moving out the other side, sometimes I look back and I go, Where did 2020, 2021, 2022 go?
And now, what does it look like to live in company with the Lord? What does it look like to lean on Him and let Him love you to real life, abundant life, in such a way that fear and anxiety and stress and overwhelm doesn’t define me? I’m not just getting up every morning and looking for a way through. But I actually have a way of life that centers and grounds me, roots me, and calms me, and keeps me such that the person of Christ, the being of Christ, is my way through.
“I’m not just getting up every morning and looking for a way through. But I actually have a way of life that centers and grounds me, roots me, and calms me, and keeps me such that the person of Christ, the being of Christ, is my way through.” – Ann Voskamp
Abundant Joy Through Gratitude
My very first memory is being four years old and seeing my sister killed in a farm accident in front of my mother and I. And as a little girl, anxiety completely overwhelmed and defined me. I had ulcers when I was diagnosed in grade two. And then as a teen, I was cutting. By the time I was in university, I was diagnosed with panic attacks and agoraphobia. So I just was really defined by a lot of fears. And someone dared me to pick up a pen and write down a hundred things I was grateful for, a hundred things I loved. And as I picked up that pen, I started to write down the things that I was grateful for, things I loved, and actually what I’m doing is counting all the ways that God loves me. And I ended up writing over a thousand gifts, a thousand things I was grateful for.
Ultimately, what we’re all looking for is, Is there a way of life that leads me into abundant joy? And if joy is a function of gratitude and gratitude is a function of perspective, how can I shift and change my perspective moment by moment? Sometimes we think, I need to find a way through to a different place in life, or, I need to change the circumstances and the situation in my life. When ultimately, what needs to have a shift is my perspective, to see that not only other gifts and graces right here I can give God thanks for, but ultimately that God Himself, His very presence, His very being, is with me right here.
“What we’re all looking for is, Is there a way of life that leads me into abundant joy? And if joy is a function of gratitude and gratitude is a function of perspective, how can I shift and change my perspective moment by moment? What needs to have a shift is my perspective, to see that not only other gifts and graces right here I can give God thanks for, but ultimately that God Himself, His very presence, His very being, is with me right here.” – Ann Voskamp
So that really has been this journey where gratitude was the gateway into His presence and now, How do I live in His presence, moment by moment, day by day?
Waiting With a Heart of Hope
I have often described my faith in general, my life as a whole, as a practice of waiting on the Lord. And I think each of us—no matter whatever season of life we’re in—there are things that we have laid before the Lord in prayer and we are in this open-handed posture of waiting. Sometimes that waiting is with tears. Sometimes in that waiting, there’s this temptation to clench our fists and to say, “Lord, I desperately want the story to unfold this certain way. I’ve been waiting so long, Lord.” It says in the Psalms, “How long, O Lord? How long?” So each of us, no matter where we’re at, there is this subtext to our life that is so much waiting. But are we waiting with hope? Can we feel like when we’re waiting on the Lord and we’re at the end of our rope, that we actually have hope because our hearts are being bound to the Lord’s?
“I think each of us—no matter whatever season of life we’re in—there are things that we have laid before the Lord in prayer and we are in this open-handed posture of waiting. Can we feel like when we’re waiting on the Lord and we’re at the end of our rope, that we actually have hope because our hearts are being bound to the Lord’s?” – Ann Voskamp
So for me, there are certain parts of my life I call the unspoken broken. Sometimes they’re broken parts of your life that you don’t even know quite how to put words around. And the unspoken broken, I’m sitting there in a posture of waiting on the Lord, hoping. And as we wait on the Lord with a posture of attentiveness, we are actually moving into God’s presence, not so much with questions from the Lord, but when we open up Scripture, we see that the Lord has questions for us. Can we attend to God’s questions for us in the midst of the waiting? Can we attend to the questions that He asks us? Who do you say that I am? Do we know who Jesus actually says He is? Can we begin our prayers with, “Lord, I know You’re asking me who You are, and I know that You are my Good Shepherd, the One who leaves the ninety-nine and pursues the one. Lord, I know that You are the door that I want to enter into Your presence.” So can we attend to the question, Who does God say that I am? and actually know intimately who He is?
The same question that He asks Hagar in Genesis 16, “Where are you coming from and where are you going to?” That would slow us down enough to really attend in the midst of our waiting. Is this waiting cultivating bitterness in my own heart? Or in this waiting, am I coming from a place of surrender? Is this waiting keeping me active so that I’m abiding in You, that You are my abode, Lord, so that as I move forward, I am resting in You? So I think it’s like the two chambers of one heart. Can we fix our eyes upon Him so that our hearts are enlarged by His love, that we would see that who but Jesus would pay such a high price to love us to death and back to the fullest life?
Making Time to Encounter God
I think it’s easy for all of us—in the midst of our busy lives, our harried lives—how do we have a devotional life that is meaningful, that is consistent, and that our devotions are not compartmentalized into a box, such that when we leave that time and we move out into the rest of the day, we box up the Lord and we aren’t in intimate communion with Him? We don’t want our devotions, our quiet time with the Lord, to actually be fragmented. We actually want that devotional time to weave through the rest of our day, all the moments and the hours keeping our hearts devoted to Him, our eyes attentive to Him, us constantly listening to Him, His Spirit saying, “This is the way, walk in it.”
“We don’t want our devotions, our quiet time with the Lord, to actually be fragmented. We actually want that devotional time to weave through the rest of our day, all the moments and the hours keeping our hearts devoted to Him, our eyes attentive to Him, us constantly listening to Him, His Spirit saying, ‘This is the way, walk in it.’” – Ann Voskamp
I think to have a devotional life that is meaningful and consistent, I think it comes back to, for me personally, can you slow down enough in your devotional life to pick up a pen? I believe it’s John Piper who says that he doesn’t understand how pens and pencils have eyes within them that help us see. And I think sometimes if we can sit down and open up God’s Word, when we read a devotional, when we read Scripture, can we then pick up a pen and write down, “What is my fresh revelation from God’s Word? What is God’s Word speaking to me?” There’s been seasons in my life where I’ve picked up a pen and after I’ve read Scripture, I take my pen and journal God’s Word back to me personally—writing these scriptures, this text, back to me, naming myself and speaking the Scripture back to me. I think it’s important for us to remember the semantics around when we say “my devotional time” or “my quiet time,” do we understand that it’s really an encounter with the living Lord?
I think sometimes our understanding of God’s love for us is really cerebral and it stays at a very veneer level in our minds and it can be challenging to migrate God’s infinite, compassionate, gentle love for us from a cerebral level down to the marrow of our bones. And when you encounter Him, when you gaze upon Him in the Word, when you sit and read God’s Word—which is truly a love letter back to us—you realize, Oh, this is how He loves me. I‘m gazing into God’s heart for me. When we open up the book of John and we see this is the One who says He is life and He came to give us life to the full, this is the One who says He is love. This is the one who says He is the way, the truth, the life. When I open up His Word and read His story, this is really how He feels about me and how He wants to shape and form me to live in communion with Him, to be like C .S. Lewis says, “a little Christ in the world.”
All of us are searching for, longing for, hoping we don’t miss out on the fullest life, the most meaningful life, an abundant life. And that is exactly why Jesus comes, to actually love us to the fullest life. And right in the midst of where we’re suffering, He sees our suffering, and Jesus doesn’t sit still. It’s our crisis that drives Him to the cross, and it’s His love that always rushes to hold our honest lament. So I would hope that in the midst of the tender places of our lives, the places where we feel alone or abandoned or overwhelmed, we would accept this invitation to literally pilgrimage with Jesus through Scripture, through His Word, and actually experience moving from being overwhelmed and barely holding on, to truly being loved to life, the abundant life.
“All of us are searching for, longing for, hoping we don’t miss out on the fullest life, the most meaningful life, an abundant life. And that is exactly why Jesus comes, to actually love us to the fullest life.” – Ann Voskamp
So it’s a constant coming back to Scripture and saying, “Lord, reveal the idolatry to me by revealing where I actually am more attracted to and my heart’s affections are stirred by more of the things of this world than You Yourself, Lord.” And then it’s a very reflective experience where you think, Where is my heart in relation to Him? So you actually feel yourself moving more intimately closer in communion with Christ Himself.
It would be my joy and gift to read from Sarah Young’s Jesus Listens for March 2nd:
Faithful God,
I’ve found that time devoted to You blesses and strengthens me immensely. You open my understanding to Your Word – enabling me to comprehend Scripture better and apply it to my life.
Please help me discern Your will clearly as I make plans for this day. When I walk alongside You, seeking to do Your will, You empower me to handle whatever comes my way. Lord, teach me how to trust in You at all times – in all circumstances.
In Your trustworthy Name, Jesus,
Amen
Narrator: To learn more about Ann Voskamp, please visit www.annvoskamp.com, and be sure to check out her new devotional titled, Loved to Life: A 40-Day Pilgrimage with Love Himself That Will Change Your Life, at your favorite retailer.
Stay tuned to Brennley Brown’s story after a brief message.
Celebrate the Season with Jesus Listens for Lent & Easter
Walk through the season of Lent with an intentional focus on your Savior, and prepare for the joy and victory of His resurrection with Jesus Listens for Lent & Easter. This book offers seasonally-themed devotions from Sarah Young’s New York Times bestseller Jesus Listens. Inside, you’ll find prayers, reflections, and Bible verses based on Jesus’ life and sacrifice, plus stunning spring and Easter illustrations, making this a holiday treasure to cherish for years to come.
This book makes the perfect gift for anyone longing to draw closer to Jesus during the Lenten and Easter seasons, for families who want to cultivate a tradition of seasonal prayers and devotions together, and for those looking for peace, forgiveness, and a deeper experience of trusting God.
As you pray Scripture throughout this season of remembering Christ’s death and resurrection, you’ll experience how prayer connects you to God, helps you seek forgiveness, and brings you the inexpressible joy and freedom of knowing that Christ has risen.
Find Jesus Listens for Lent & Easter today at your favorite retailer.
Our next guest is Brennley Brown, whose artistry is deeply influenced by a rich blend of traditional country and gospel sounds. Growing up on a ranch with memories of family sing-alongs, Brennley’s passion for storytelling became the foundation of her songwriting. From performing at open mic nights in Los Angeles to competing on The Voice, she reflects on the profound impact music and faith have had on her life.
Brennley Brown: Hi, my name is Brennley Brown, and I am a singer, songwriter, & artist based in Nashville, Tennessee—originally from California. I love Jesus and I love writing songs about Jesus and I’m grateful to be here today.
I grew up in the high desert in Southern California, a small town called Apple Valley. I grew up with horses on a small ranch. My dad introduced me to a lot of traditional country music growing up. I listened to a lot of seventies country—Waylon Jennings, Emmylou Harris, Dolly Parton—and just fell in love with the storytelling aspect of country music. My mom introduced me to a lot of gospel music growing up as well, and I remember being outside with my dad just blaring country music and then my mom coming out and saying, “Turn off that rowdy country music and turn on some gospel music.” So I was just heavily influenced with both genres most of my whole life. I’m grateful to have grown up in a place where there weren’t a ton of music opportunities, but my parents graciously saw I had this voice and this gift at a young age and really encouraged me to start singing and start playing music.
When I was young, my mom went through a really challenging time with her health and years and years of it being undiagnosed. I remember with my family, just the unknown of what was going to happen in her health. It was a scary time. I remember one evening going to my room just by myself and opening up the Word of God and His promises just being so incredibly real. And for the first time, realizing how near He is to us when we are struggling, when we are going through hard things.
Music was something that my mom and I, through that time, could do together. I would sit by her bed and sing worship songs, sing country songs, and it was such a powerful tool that the Lord used in our life to bring joy in the midst of something really challenging and really hard.
“Music was something that my mom and I could do together. I would sit by her bed and sing worship songs, sing country songs, and it was such a powerful tool that the Lord used in our life to bring joy in the midst of something really challenging and really hard.” – Brennley Brown
When we do go through these hard things in life, it’s always an opportunity for us to lean in and grow closer to Jesus. And I’m thankful that He was close to me during that time. It really helped me start to write songs that reflected the hope that we have in Him, truly, and that it’s real, it’s something that is not fading away, not distant, but a hope that is sure.
I started writing music when I was around twelve or thirteen years old. My mom would drive me down to one of the only places in Southern California that allowed minors to come and play their music, and it was this open mic night in Los Angeles. We would drive from Apple Valley to Los Angeles every Thursday and I was playing some of my original music, and a vocal contractor from Disney Animation happened to be in the audience, which was not a coincidence. It’s totally the Lord. I met her and she came up and said, “Hey, have you ever done any voiceover work?” I’m like, “No, I don’t even know what that is.” So that kind of started me on this path to singing for a lot of the different animation shows at the time. It was called “sweetening,” so I’d literally go in and do a lot of the background singing for the music. That started to grow and I was able to audition and book some speaking roles in voiceover for DreamWorks and Disney. It’s been such an incredible journey and I’m so grateful.
Being on The Voice taught me so much, especially the kind of artist that I wanted to be. I think being on the show at fourteen years old, there was so much pressure on me through that time, but I’m so grateful for the Lord’s grace through all of that. And through that whole process, I never thought I would make it as far as I did. But as the Lord carried me through each week, I realized just the healing power of music and why, really, the Lord made it. Through that process, I really wanted to define who I was as an artist and start writing, being able to put out messages of hope because music had offered me that throughout my whole life. Music was a gift, and I think it’s continued to just light a fire under me to write songs that can bring hope the way that music did to me during that time.
Jesus Anywhere
I am so excited to share this record. It’s called Jesus Anywhere. It is a project that I have poured my heart and soul into, and I have been writing these songs for years. It feels just like a massive piece of my heart going out to the world. It’s about how the Lord shows up in the most unlikely of places. It’s a reminder that every day we have that same opportunity to love on people and to show them Jesus in the way that we live, in the words that we speak.
“Every day we have that same opportunity to love on people and to show them Jesus in the way that we live, in the words that we speak.” – Brennley Brown
I think oftentimes we think Jesus can fit in a specific box. He can only be in these sorts of places or show up in this way. I wanted to reflect my love for the Lord and how I believe He shows up in people’s lives today, as a reminder that when God places a dream and a calling in your life, it’s not going to be easy. It may look a lot different to the outside world. I pray that it just brings people hope and meets them where they’re at, no matter what stage of life they’re in.
“I wanted to reflect my love for the Lord and how I believe He shows up in people’s lives today, as a reminder that when God places a dream and a calling in your life, it’s not going to be easy.” – Brennley Brown
An Honest Rapport with Jesus
When God uniquely places a calling and a dream on your heart, it’s not going to look like what the world may think it should. What He’s been so faithful to do in my life is equip me with everything I’ve needed along the way. And there’s been hard things. There’s been moments that I’ve wanted to give up. But He has always been there to encourage me and to walk this dream out with me.
“When God uniquely places a calling and a dream on your heart, it’s not going to look like what the world may think it should.” – Brennley Brown
Having an open and honest rapport with Jesus is the best and safest place you can be. Prayer strengthened my relationship with Jesus. It was the place that I could go to pour everything out to Him.
I’ve actually grown up reading the Jesus Calling books. My mom was the first one that introduced me to them. We would have them all over our house growing up. We would have them on the coffee table. We would have them on the kitchen table. What’s so sweet is through all of the years of reading, my mom and I will still screenshot our Jesus Calling books if there’s one that really resonates with us. We’ll send them back and forth even now at twenty-three. But even from a young age, we would read them together. I remember every morning sitting at the kitchen table, Jesus Calling was a part of our devotion time together. The daily reminders of God’s promises and truths continue to be just inspiring and encouraging in my walk with Jesus.
It’s important to connect with the Lord every day because it is where we find all of our strength, all of our peace, our rest in our lives. I’ve found that if I miss my time with the Lord in the morning, it does truly set the pace for the rest of my day, because then I’m trying to find all my strength within myself, and everything that I am flows from who He is. I find it vitally important every day. And I’m human—there’s days that I’m going to forget or we get caught up in the busyness of life, right? But He has given us such a powerful, incredible example of not only how to live, but being reminded of His promises daily—of the hope that we have in Him, the promise that He is with us, the promise that He goes before us—are only found in the Word of God. You’ll just be encouraged. You’ll be strengthened. You’ll be inspired. And you’ll be able to rest.
“[God] has given us such a powerful, incredible example of not only how to live, but being reminded of His promises daily—of the hope that we have in Him, the promise that He is with us, the promise that He goes before us—are only found in the Word of God.” – Brennley Brown
I’ll be reading from Jesus Listens, October 12th:
Jesus, my Treasure,
Teach me how to live more fully in the present—refusing to worry about tomorrow.
I really do want to live present tense in Your Presence, making You the main pursuit of my life. This is quite a struggle for me because planning and worrying come so naturally to me.
I’ve found that pursuing a close walk with You is the most effective way to live abundantly. I need to keep bringing my thoughts back to You whenever they wander. I can return to You joyfully, knowing that You take great delight in me and rejoice over me with singing.
In Your delightful Name,
Amen
Narrator: To learn more about Brennley Brown’s music, you may please visit www.brennleybrownmusic.com, and be sure to check out her new EP, Jesus Anywhere, wherever you get your music.
If you’d like to hear more stories about calming our hearts and minds, check out our interview with Dr. Alan Weissenbacher.
Next week: Nikki Walton
Next time on the Jesus Calling Podcast, we’ll hear from podcast host, author, and advocate for holistic wellness, Nikki Walton. Nikki shares how she went looking for something that would fulfill her, and how she learned that the love that comes from God will turn our minds toward what we need.
Nikki Walton: Only love is here. When you know this truth, you don’t have to wrestle with your mind. You don’t have to fight your thoughts. You don’t have to silence them. There aren’t any left when you know only Jesus is here.
